wc3campaigns
WC3C Homepage - www.wc3c.netUser Control Panel (Requires Log-In)Engage in discussions with other users and join contests in the WC3C forums!Read one of our many tutorials, ranging in difficulty from beginner to advanced!Show off your artistic talents in the WC3C Gallery!Download quality models, textures, spells (vJASS/JASS), systems, and scripts!Download maps that have passed through our rigorous approval process!

Go Back   Wc3C.net > Warcraft III Modding > Hosted Projects > AMAI
User Name
Password
Register Rules Get Hosted! Chat Pastebin FAQ and Rules Members List Calendar



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-20-2006, 01:28 PM   #16
crazedcougar
User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 40

crazedcougar has little to show at this moment (8)

Send a message via AIM to crazedcougar
Default

I did a game yesterday, got a few minor problems. This was a 2v2 with me watching. normal and insane vs another normal and insane.

The biggest problem was that they would attack an enemy going right by a creep camp, get distracted by it, and go home. This happened once with a Level 1 hero and 2 foots vs and orange dot, the humans got slaughtered. It happened again with a larger army, they killed the camp and went home, having forgotten about the enemy. Silly AI... ;-)
crazedcougar is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links - Login to hide this ad!
Old 09-20-2006, 04:25 PM   #17
DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
Robie williams ROFL
 
DeaD_MeN_WalkiN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 292

DeaD_MeN_WalkiN will become famous soon enough (37)DeaD_MeN_WalkiN will become famous soon enough (37)

Send a message via AIM to DeaD_MeN_WalkiN Send a message via MSN to DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by crazedcougar
The biggest problem was that they would attack an enemy going right by a creep camp, get distracted by it, and go home.

Same issue but with an Insane AI, I'm gona write a huge Comment as soon as my game finish, Be prepared for serious Crtitism, Positive feedback Oo.

Post Two (making me sound like a mod :P):

1- Here we begin..:

Human's base = Wreck ,Mass Towers infront of the base (really infront) without farms blocking them! (Expansion has 1 tower though -.-)

2- Resources:
Every race has a stockpile of atleast 2000 gold unspent..

3-Elves:
Elven archers infront of a melee orc army 1v1?!! (Game is 2v2 but the elf marched before his ally which is a human with footmen..).

4-Lumber mills,War Mill, Graveyard and Hunter's Hall:
They actually are placed in middle of the base ....

5-Expedition forces (This is dumb, Only used for campaigns..):
Imagine this, A human Leaves 75% of his advanced army in his base for guarding and attacks his main enemy army with a bunch a foots and priests??

6-Bug: Wreck Havok Taunt:
Wreck havok taunt didnt actually say the following:
Wreck havok, Left an army of dead orcs (example are orcs) back there.

What I got is:
Wreck havok, Left an army of dead (nothing after dead other than 2 spaces..).

Lots more, As soon as I become free I'll give you the replay.
__________________
Always rep People + Me
Nub who killed 500 other Nubs.

Retired (Well I'm still doing freelance works).

Last edited by DeaD_MeN_WalkiN : 09-20-2006 at 04:56 PM.
DeaD_MeN_WalkiN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2006, 12:33 PM   #18
Strategy Master
Great Sage
 
Strategy Master's Avatar


Project Leader: AMAI
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 711

Submissions (1)

Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)

Default

Finally got a chance to look over

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaD_MeN_WalkiN

1- Here we begin..:

Human's base = Wreck ,Mass Towers infront of the base (really infront) without farms blocking them! (Expansion has 1 tower though -.-)

I can make the distance shorter so they build towers closer to home.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
2- Resources:
Every race has a stockpile of atleast 2000 gold unspent..

Look into it. But its probrably because the computer didn't have enough wood to use the gold. And being its the insane computer that kinda explains it as computer gets resources double as fast.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
3-Elves:
Elven archers infront of a melee orc army 1v1?!! (Game is 2v2 but the elf marched before his ally which is a human with footmen..).

noted, but no fix will be any time soon due to complications in controling such behaviour.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
4-Lumber mills,War Mill, Graveyard and Hunter's Hall:
They actually are placed in middle of the base ....

We have no control over where buildings but i have a plan to get a hidden peasant to harvest nearby wood so we can detect where the nearest wood is and force lumber mills to be built at such points.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
5-Expedition forces (This is dumb, Only used for campaigns..):
Imagine this, A human Leaves 75% of his advanced army in his base for guarding and attacks his main enemy army with a bunch a foots and priests??

Its the harass behaviour to just annoy the enemy. Really this behaviour is not really being used in the proper situations yet so the units end up being slaughtered instead of taking out some peasants. Usually works fine early game. Its late game it loses its power.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
6-Bug: Wreck Havok Taunt:
Wreck havok taunt didnt actually say the following:
Wreck havok, Left an army of dead orcs (example are orcs) back there.

What I got is:
Wreck havok, Left an army of dead (nothing after dead other than 2 spaces..).

Was you by chance observing a game as then its nothing to worry about. Always can happen when observing. If not i will have to investigate that.
__________________
Strategy Master is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2006, 01:18 PM   #19
DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
Robie williams ROFL
 
DeaD_MeN_WalkiN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 292

DeaD_MeN_WalkiN will become famous soon enough (37)DeaD_MeN_WalkiN will become famous soon enough (37)

Send a message via AIM to DeaD_MeN_WalkiN Send a message via MSN to DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
Default

He had 4000 wood and 2000 gold and wasnt doing anything with them at the moment, not even queing.

About the wreck havok, No I was a player in the game.
__________________
Always rep People + Me
Nub who killed 500 other Nubs.

Retired (Well I'm still doing freelance works).
DeaD_MeN_WalkiN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2006, 01:56 PM   #20
deutschepharma
User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 23

deutschepharma has little to show at this moment (0)

Thumbs up base building and stuff

Hi!

recently I've installed AMAI (unfortunately for me, I downloaded it months ago and installed only recently), and it's best wc3 mod ever!

having bad internet connection, sometimes i lag as much as 4 sec on bnet, so playing against cpu is my reality :(

AMAI is excellent, but I have some suggestions:

1) AI base is built badly, due to bad placing of buildings. ziggurats and burrows in front, and so on. is it possible to make it build base better? or even to have predefined bulild loctaions for starting positions in most used maps? even placing first couple of buildings in correct place would have AI base (undead for example), much tougher...

2) I feel that normal computer is inferior for me, but insane with AMAI (compliments, again) is often too much... is there a way to modify amount of gold bonus for insane ai? AI can pump units at MUCH faster pace, making it very difficult to beat. Could there be setting (like choosing the language) at the beggining of game, where players could choose how big should the bonus for AI? perhaps I could give AI advantage of, like 50% more resources, to make the game more balanced? this way, insane AI has no real need to expo at all

3) insane AI is harversting lumber beyond any need. for undead (i play mostly against undead, since i found them most difficult to beat on insane), there are ghouls harvesting, even when AI has 2000+ lumber. the AI could just stop harvesting, and put ghouls in good use

4) as I understand, computer can see all of maps, he doesn't scout. yet, he often sends only hero (without units) to shop at goblin shop, when my whole army is directly next to shop. AI hero tp's in time, though...

also, one questions. does normal AI differs from insane in any way except in bonus resources? like, does it micro better, or anything?

Last edited by deutschepharma : 10-05-2006 at 01:57 PM.
deutschepharma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2006, 10:45 AM   #21
Strategy Master
Great Sage
 
Strategy Master's Avatar


Project Leader: AMAI
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 711

Submissions (1)

Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaD_MeN_WalkiN
He had 4000 wood and 2000 gold and wasnt doing anything with them at the moment, not even queing.

About the wreck havok, No I was a player in the game.

Right my tests have revealed a possible build code crash linked kinda to when the player builds an expansion or wants an expansion. I'm currently investigating this and have no known cause as of yet.


@deutschepharma:
1: Well i have fixed a bug in the build at mine functions so certain players will build a number of farms at back of base. Lumber mill placement near lumber is also now controlled for next amai version. But its not possible to make certain build arrangements for maps as amai can't tell what map its playing on. Its impossible to do with functions we have available. The nearest we could get to simulating this will just cause the base to more likely get units stuck.

2: hmmmm.

3: Well ghouls when not attacking should all harvest lumber anyway when they are at home. But i'll check to see whether they are harvesting correctly cause the check decides how many ghouls to take along based on the ai's resources.

4: There should be a check insane amai cheats fully to see if enemies there, but normal has to notice if hes near enemy before running away. Sounds like it aint working. I'll check it out.

Does insane differ from normal. Yes. Insane cheats more than normal. Insane computers will know when enemies are at fountain already without even having to send units there while normal will investigate first and runs away only if enemy present. So normal is cheating less in that sense. There are other little things like that. Its not overly noticeable yet though.
__________________
Strategy Master is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2006, 06:35 PM   #22
moyack
Evil Emoticon
 
moyack's Avatar


Respected User
Project Leader: PoC
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,279

Submissions (17)

moyack is a splendid one to behold (666)moyack is a splendid one to behold (666)moyack is a splendid one to behold (666)moyack is a splendid one to behold (666)

AI Tournament #2 - 2nd PlaceHero Contest - Second place

Send a message via MSN to moyack
Default

I noticed one thing when I played with an allied AI vs two normal AI enemies. When the enemy is about to reach my town, 5 seconds early my ally teleports to my base... well in that case it was someting good, but I think it's a remarkable advantage against the enemy. I think it should happen in the human way, sending units when the town is under attack.

Other thing that would make the AI more "human" should be removing the advantage to know where is the enemy town. I think the AI must send an assault group to the unexplored mines, if it can't find enemies, go to the next mine, and so on until it can get an enemy town.

Last edited by moyack : 10-11-2006 at 06:36 PM.
moyack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2006, 09:53 PM   #23
Shush
User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3

Shush has little to show at this moment (0)

Default

@Moyack, the first thing is humanly, kind of. Some players prefer to backup their allies before the attack begins to earn more EXP from the attack. If kind of explainable when some of the map is explored and the ally can see the enemy approaching their friends. I'm sorry for playing the role of Startegy Master, but I think this doesn't need modifications.

BTW, in one game I played solo VS an AMAI, I totally ruined his base, but haven't won. seemingly, he somehow survived, so I started scouting. he has hidden one Acolyte in the right upper corner of the map for some reason. There was no close Gold Mine and it was on water, so it much disables AMAI thinking to expand his base. Anyway, it was pretty strange. I've killed the Acolyte and won, but still, the scouting took about an half an hour.
Shush is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2006, 10:58 PM   #24
deutschepharma
User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 23

deutschepharma has little to show at this moment (0)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Strategy Master
Right my tests have revealed a possible build code crash linked kinda to when the player builds an expansion or wants an expansion. I'm currently investigating this and have no known cause as of yet.

Yes, the same thing is done with other building by blizzard AI, and, unfortenately, by AMAI also. i have replay (but probably every one has one) fighting in AMAI base, while he constantly builds something (often not-so-crucial, like hunters hall) directly NEXT to my force, despite the trigger 'town threatened' is on. i think AMAI should stop building while attacked, at least depending on resources (mentioned elf ai spent virtually EVERYTHING, trying to build stuff while attacked), maybe to do that with towers if having large resources, but stop when resources are low?

@deutschepharma:

2: hmmmm.

Does insane differ from normal. Yes. Insane cheats more than normal. Insane computers will know when enemies are at fountain already without even having to send units there while normal will investigate first and runs away only if enemy present. So normal is cheating less in that sense. There are other little things like that. Its not overly noticeable yet though.


Thanks! I've also downloaded techical build, played few games and make some observations:

1) does sending you the replays help? i mean, i play considerable amount of games, so if i collect replays with gross mistakes and mail you, will it be useful?

i would gladly do that, especially if there is a way to turn off debug messages during the gameplay, and somehow see them during the replay. they are kind of annoying during game, and also reveal AMAI's plans...

2) wisp comes near AMAI town, there is a trigger 'town threatened', AMAI inrerrupts creaping and returns to 'defend' the city. can this be changed in a way that wisps and acolytest (which are not normally tower rush) does not set this trigger, at least not in small numbers of not before they start tower rush? later could be applied to peasants and peons as well.

3) if insane ai sees whole map, could it adjust its strategy according to type of units opponent have? i've played game with my girlfriend against normal and insane, and for last ten minutes, my army consisted of 2 heroes, 1-2 statues, and LOTS of gargoyles. her army was bears/dryads. we encountered AMAI (orc & elf) several times, each time won the battle because poor anti air, yet they never changed their build to anti air, even they have rebuilded their armies three times. i'm aware that this may be difficult to implement, but it would be great if computers would actualy adjust their build according to opponents.

4) regarding 'hmmmmm', which i didn't understand. ok, i'm not best player in the world, this kind of stuff often happen to me with insane AI, who in the first few minutes has:
- 3 crypts, and llike 15 ghouls
- upgraded base, and finished 2nd hero
- building all t2 buildings
- having number of potions from the shop
- having T1 all graveyard upgrades

in the same time, i have 2 heroes, upgraded base, just started t2 buildings and only 4 grunts. mind me, all the time i played very good, creepjacked AI, destroyed couple of ziggurats, without loosing any units. I also have like 50 gold and lumber, meaning i didn't mass resources. I also haven't make any upgrades, due to lack of resources -anyway, i can send the replay?

maybe grubby would win this, but not me (i'm not ashamed to say - i'm an average player at best), especially while every now and then, groups of 3 ghouls, statue and necromancer are coming.

don't get me wrong, I appriciate this project greatly (it's my favorite passtime), but is it intention to make AI more humanly? and games against AI similar to games against real opponents? i don't like using handicaps (either on me - when against normals, either on AI - when against insane), since this in clearly not normal situation.

again, is it possible to reduce amount of resources insane gets? to perhaps chose between likke 12, 15, 18 and 20? and in the same time to keep all the ai cheats (seeing whole maps), since they are really beneficial to play? this way, harassing computer (meaning peons and such) would really have some meaning - with insane AI resources it is clear waste of time...



thanks and best regards!
deutschepharma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2006, 09:32 AM   #25
Strategy Master
Great Sage
 
Strategy Master's Avatar


Project Leader: AMAI
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 711

Submissions (1)

Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)

Default

@deutschepharma:

1) Replays do help but i don't need them in technical builds due to my internal build changes too often, so the replay can actually play differently.

2)Shouldn't be happening but i'll check this out

3)They supposed to do that. Investigating.

4)I'm not going to modify insane difficulty resources any time soon, if i do it will be some later build where its clear it no longer needs resources bonus to be good. Its supposed to be hard. Its an insane map hacking computer who if was on battle.net would be permanantly banned . Normal opponents are designed to play in a human way and is what i test amai on as that is the most fair environment. Getting amai playing well in a fair environment will automatically scale with the easy and insane difficulties.
__________________
Strategy Master is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2006, 11:33 AM   #26
deutschepharma
User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 23

deutschepharma has little to show at this moment (0)

Default

hi!

after playing numerous games against RC1, i've selected few with typical problems. human AMAI still tends to do most mistakes, but much less than in beta. attached are replays and also the maps (don't really know if you need them, i sent them just in case)

game 1:
- at 4:30, AMAI misjudges and attacks hero and WE with 2 riflemen. from this moment to the end of game, AMAI totally stops building troops and heroes, although he had resources (as would human who panicked :)


game 2:
- at 6:30, AMAI looses hero and few footmen. he should have tp-ed to save hero and untis. at 11:50, he fails to tp again, this time loosing only his hero. during the same attack, AMAI has two more heroes sitting in his base and not participating in attack...


game 3:

- at 12:00, AMAI has an army of 10 riflemen, expo, 900/300 resources and is upgrading to t3. he never upgrades riflemen, but starts to build FOOTMEN, also continuing at t3. maybe riflemen long rifles upgrade should be more important in this case? maybe AMAI should upgrade more agressively when massing one unit type? also, when t3 melee units are available, it should stop building t1 melee
(footmen)...
- at the last few minutes of the same game, AMAI stopped building army even he had enough resources


game 4:

- at 2:30, AMAI goes militia creeping using gold peasants (takes 4, then returns 2 to gold). Gold peasants shouldn't be used for creeping? this is mostly fixed in RC1, but happened more oftenly in last beta
- having hero surrounded, insane AMAI tp-es to his own, instead of threatened partners base. can this be fixed? up to 6:00, insane AMAI moves hero chaoticaly, not really doing anything. whole time, his partner's base is threatened
- at 4:30 "i can't build there' starts. AMAI (teal, insane) is at 30 food, cancels building farm numerous times (probably because of lumber peasant in the place intended for farm) for the next 2 minutes, and then gets in lumber-trouble, despite being insane :)
- at 5:15 pink AMAI (pink, easy) loses hero to creeps who are awake during the night. can recognition of no-sleep creeps be implemented?
- at 5:30, insane AMAI finally manages to build farm. moments later, he builds lumbermill and arcane vault, a way too late
- at 7:30, lumber trouble starts. AMAI has over 2000 gold, and no lumber which remains true for the rest of the game. can a switch of gold peasant to wood be made in this particular case (large sum of gold and no wood)?
- at 8:20, AMAI hero dies. AMAI makes no attempt to revive hero for the rest of the game, despite having enough resources and food

anyway, you did excellent job, since these faults are from, like, hundred games i've played...
Attached Files
File Type: zip amai_bugs.zip (1.62 MB, 19 views)
deutschepharma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2006, 09:11 PM   #27
ShadowDestroyer
User
 
ShadowDestroyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 375

ShadowDestroyer is on a distinguished road (15)

Send a message via AIM to ShadowDestroyer
Default

Make it easier to use for non-melee maps.
__________________
The Shadow of Destruction

clanmord.net
Try Tropical Tag, Militia Rebellion, Capture the Flag WSG, and Footmen Frenzy XV!
ShadowDestroyer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2006, 10:07 PM   #28
moyack
Evil Emoticon
 
moyack's Avatar


Respected User
Project Leader: PoC
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,279

Submissions (17)

moyack is a splendid one to behold (666)moyack is a splendid one to behold (666)moyack is a splendid one to behold (666)moyack is a splendid one to behold (666)

AI Tournament #2 - 2nd PlaceHero Contest - Second place

Send a message via MSN to moyack
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowDestroyer
Make it easier to use for non-melee maps.
AMAI stands Advanced MELEE Artificial Intelligence. So it means that you can't get full functionality for non melee maps such Aoes or hero arenas.


Anyways, Strategy Master is who has the last word, probably it can be done creating specific jobs for the AI, which can give to it a desired behaviour.
moyack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2006, 07:09 PM   #29
Strategy Master
Great Sage
 
Strategy Master's Avatar


Project Leader: AMAI
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 711

Submissions (1)

Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)Strategy Master has a spectacular aura about (77)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowDestroyer
Make it easier to use for non-melee maps.

I guess you mean for hero area type maps etc. Thats not gonna happen as that requires a whole new system and would take too long to implement. Your have to code your own scripts using whatever methods you do for that.

What I am looking into is extending the campaign script calls to use amai type computers but with the simplicity of simple campaign scripts. This will allow players to make simple campaign ai's but has amai systems enabled. This is only in the idea stages though so nothing solid will start yet.
__________________
Strategy Master is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2007, 09:12 AM   #30
deutschepharma
User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 23

deutschepharma has little to show at this moment (0)

Default tower rushes

hi again!

is it possible for AMAI to do tower rushes during night?
deutschepharma is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:46 AM.


Affiliates
The Hubb The JASS Vault Clan WEnW Campaign Creations Clan CBS GamesModding Flixreel Videos

Powered by vBulletin (Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd).
Hosted by www.OICcam.com
IT Support and Services provided by Executive IT Services