Model talking - ask general modeling questions here (NOT model editing)

Daminon · 01-15-2007, 09:42 PM

THREAD GUIDELINES

This thread is for you to ask any questions you have or advice you might need regarding modeling, animation, rigging, unwrapping (NOT texturing, just the process of unwrapping) especially in 3ds max. It doesn't have to be strictly related to wc3 modding, so any questions you might have ask here, do not open another thread.
I repeat: NO QUESTIONS ABOUT MODEL EDITING! This is strictly about modeling/animating from scratch.
This is no place for requests or to ask about where you can find certain models. Stuff like that belongs in the
Artist's Discussion and Queries forum.

- TDR

____________________________________________________________________________________________
Ok...

please don't kill me

What is subdivide?

TDR · 01-15-2007, 10:51 PM

to progressively add more polygons (like cutting edges through existing polys) so you get more detail when modeling. You can subdivide until you reach your desired level of detail. After that you subdivide it all with mesh smooth. That's why it's called subdivision surface modeling. Remember to keep all polys quads when modeling high poly. Another way of modeling is with nonuniform rational B splines (NURBS), but I don't like it.

Daminon · 01-15-2007, 11:27 PM

Is this subdivision? Btw for some reason it doesn't feel good that there are no visible edges connetcing those other edges. :S

TDR · 01-16-2007, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daminon

Is this subdivision? Btw for some reason it doesn't feel good that there are no visible edges connetcing those other edges. :S

what...are...you...talking about?
there's subdivision surface modeling and NURBS modeling and this ain't nurbs. (if you're referring to andy's models)

Daminon · 01-16-2007, 12:10 PM

Oh! :O Sorry forgot to add the picture. Now you can see art-mann. :)

TDR · 01-16-2007, 11:30 PM

oh. well what are you wating for? cut your way through the polygons, starting from those verts you marked, so you have all 4 or 3 (if it's low poly) sided polygons.
Suggestion: if those are teeth, make them separate from the rest of the mesh. Just place some pyramids in there. On a production (for movies & such, like made by pros) model the gums and teeth are also separated from the body mesh.

Daminon · 01-17-2007, 01:00 AM

@TDR
But if I just cut where I need extra detail, the nearest polygons get screwy. Like this:

If I want to subdivide just that polygon I have to 'fix' the connecting ones as well or I get lots of trigons. :|

Btw the model isn't high poly, I think it will be around 3000 but I guess I will try to not have trigons.

Here is another way of adding details to certain areas I think (the eye), but I just can't imagine how they make that. It feels like impossible.

About the teeth thing, yes it's theets. :) Are there any more common details that usually should be separate meshes?

TDR · 01-17-2007, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daminon

@TDR
But if I just cut where I need extra detail, the nearest polygons get screwy. Like this:

If I want to subdivide just that polygon I have to 'fix' the connecting ones as well or I get lots of trigons. :|

well yeah...the second pic is the right solution for that.

What do you find impossible about that dog? It's plain poly modeling.

Daminon · 01-17-2007, 01:04 PM

Dog picture
I just can't understand how to make it that way. It's like they added lots of polygons without adding any. I... just can't understand how it works.

Here is the undeside of the head. Is the topology ok? I feel that it isn't. :(

Topology learning is fun. :)

TDR · 01-17-2007, 04:41 PM

I moved this discussion to a new thread, to stop spamming poor andy's gallery.

They added lots of polygons without adding any? you're making no sense here. Dude. It's just polygon modeling, starting from a box or a plane or a spline or whatever, basically low poly modeling (with all polygons quads) with a mesh smooth applied! Nothing too complicated.
About that thing you showed, is that some nose of a dog or something? Anyway try to keep equal distances between polygons, that's unless you want something hard-edged.

Daminon · 01-17-2007, 06:33 PM

Ok lets leave the dog.

No it's no dog I am making, it's a uhm, non-real life creature. I wont show it unless I am very proud of it when it's ready. The thing behind is the throat. My point in the picture is should I add some extra edge-line to keep the tetragons better looking? If I do then there will be another line on the throat as well.

Btw nice hack!

TDR · 01-17-2007, 09:38 PM

well yeah another edge loop would do good 'cause it will add more geometry to that throat thing.

Daminon · 01-18-2007, 04:45 PM

Hm you said you didn't like NURBS , why? Do you like patches? I like patches. :)

TDR · 01-21-2007, 05:45 PM

I only like sub-d modeling, I feel more comfortable manipulating polygons.

Daminon · 01-22-2007, 07:08 PM

Do you know about the tool PolyBoost? It seems to have some cute features. :D
http://www.polyboost.com/features.htm

Do you use some other plugin? Glu3d?

01-15-2007, 09:42 PM	#1
Daminon WWIAFTM! Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 588 Submissions (12)	Model talking - ask general modeling questions here (NOT model editing) THREAD GUIDELINES This thread is for you to ask any questions you have or advice you might need regarding modeling, animation, rigging, unwrapping (NOT texturing, just the process of unwrapping) especially in 3ds max. It doesn't have to be strictly related to wc3 modding, so any questions you might have ask here, do not open another thread. I repeat: NO QUESTIONS ABOUT MODEL EDITING! This is strictly about modeling/animating from scratch. This is no place for requests or to ask about where you can find certain models. Stuff like that belongs in the Artist's Discussion and Queries forum. - TDR ____________________________________________________________________________________________ Ok... please don't kill me What is subdivide? Last edited by TDR : 09-05-2007 at 10:40 AM.

01-15-2007, 10:51 PM	#2
TDR ♪♫ Modeling & Gallery Moderator Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,481 Submissions (84)	to progressively add more polygons (like cutting edges through existing polys) so you get more detail when modeling. You can subdivide until you reach your desired level of detail. After that you subdivide it all with mesh smooth. That's why it's called subdivision surface modeling. Remember to keep all polys quads when modeling high poly. Another way of modeling is with nonuniform rational B splines (NURBS), but I don't like it. __________________ DOOM models - currently on hold... I DON'T TAKE ANY REQUESTS! p o r t f o l i o

01-15-2007, 11:27 PM	#3
Daminon WWIAFTM! Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 588 Submissions (12)	Is this subdivision? Btw for some reason it doesn't feel good that there are no visible edges connetcing those other edges. :S Last edited by Daminon : 01-16-2007 at 12:10 PM.

01-16-2007, 11:30 PM	#6
TDR ♪♫ Modeling & Gallery Moderator Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,481 Submissions (84)	oh. well what are you wating for? cut your way through the polygons, starting from those verts you marked, so you have all 4 or 3 (if it's low poly) sided polygons. Suggestion: if those are teeth, make them separate from the rest of the mesh. Just place some pyramids in there. On a production (for movies & such, like made by pros) model the gums and teeth are also separated from the body mesh. __________________ DOOM models - currently on hold... I DON'T TAKE ANY REQUESTS! p o r t f o l i o Last edited by TDR : 01-16-2007 at 11:31 PM.

01-17-2007, 01:00 AM	#7
Daminon WWIAFTM! Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 588 Submissions (12)	@TDR But if I just cut where I need extra detail, the nearest polygons get screwy. Like this: If I want to subdivide just that polygon I have to 'fix' the connecting ones as well or I get lots of trigons. :\| Btw the model isn't high poly, I think it will be around 3000 but I guess I will try to not have trigons. Here is another way of adding details to certain areas I think (the eye), but I just can't imagine how they make that. It feels like impossible. About the teeth thing, yes it's theets. :) Are there any more common details that usually should be separate meshes? Last edited by Daminon : 01-17-2007 at 01:01 AM.

01-16-2007, 12:10 PM	#5
Daminon WWIAFTM! Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 588 Submissions (12)	Oh! :O Sorry forgot to add the picture. Now you can see art-mann. :)

01-17-2007, 01:04 PM	#9
Daminon WWIAFTM! Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 588 Submissions (12)	Dog picture I just can't understand how to make it that way. It's like they added lots of polygons without adding any. I... just can't understand how it works. Here is the undeside of the head. Is the topology ok? I feel that it isn't. :( Topology learning is fun. :) Last edited by Daminon : 01-17-2007 at 03:20 PM.

01-17-2007, 04:41 PM	#10
TDR ♪♫ Modeling & Gallery Moderator Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,481 Submissions (84)	I moved this discussion to a new thread, to stop spamming poor andy's gallery. They added lots of polygons without adding any? you're making no sense here. Dude. It's just polygon modeling, starting from a box or a plane or a spline or whatever, basically low poly modeling (with all polygons quads) with a mesh smooth applied! Nothing too complicated. About that thing you showed, is that some nose of a dog or something? Anyway try to keep equal distances between polygons, that's unless you want something hard-edged. __________________ DOOM models - currently on hold... I DON'T TAKE ANY REQUESTS! p o r t f o l i o

01-17-2007, 06:33 PM	#11
Daminon WWIAFTM! Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 588 Submissions (12)	Ok lets leave the dog. No it's no dog I am making, it's a uhm, non-real life creature. I wont show it unless I am very proud of it when it's ready. The thing behind is the throat. My point in the picture is should I add some extra edge-line to keep the tetragons better looking? If I do then there will be another line on the throat as well. Btw nice hack! Last edited by Daminon : 01-17-2007 at 06:38 PM.

01-17-2007, 09:38 PM	#12
TDR ♪♫ Modeling & Gallery Moderator Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,481 Submissions (84)	well yeah another edge loop would do good 'cause it will add more geometry to that throat thing. __________________ DOOM models - currently on hold... I DON'T TAKE ANY REQUESTS! p o r t f o l i o

01-18-2007, 04:45 PM	#13
Daminon WWIAFTM! Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 588 Submissions (12)	Hm you said you didn't like NURBS , why? Do you like patches? I like patches. :)

01-21-2007, 05:45 PM	#14
TDR ♪♫ Modeling & Gallery Moderator Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 4,481 Submissions (84)	I only like sub-d modeling, I feel more comfortable manipulating polygons. __________________ DOOM models - currently on hold... I DON'T TAKE ANY REQUESTS! p o r t f o l i o

01-22-2007, 07:08 PM	#15
Daminon WWIAFTM! Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 588 Submissions (12)	Do you know about the tool PolyBoost? It seems to have some cute features. :D http://www.polyboost.com/features.htm Do you use some other plugin? Glu3d?

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