Spell Making Session #7

[Daelin]

Okay... I promised to bring you some info about the last spell so here it is.

Sea Chant: The caster splits himself into three projections of its own, that create a triade of energy. Inside the triangle, spellcasters lose mana while non-spellcasters lose life (spellcaster is not considered non-spellcaster if runs out of mana). Both enemies and allies are affected (however, can be edited from function if two affect either enemies, either allies or both). Channelers share their damage (so killing one means killing all) but if killed before spell is finished the drained mana+life explodes and regenerates a corresponding amount to all units around them (both enemies and allies). If however the spell reaches its end the mana and life drained are lost forever as the three channelers disappear. Caster is lost forever (can never be retrieved). Spell is non-channeling but cannot be stopped unless channelers are killed.

For now I have the eye-candy finished. I'll start working on the effect now. Meanwhile, I also fixed another bug.

Bug fixes: - If leviathan died, the visibility it granted was instantly lost. Now after its death the visibility disperses only after a second.

~Daelin

[Daelin]

The spell is now complete (sorry for double-posting :D). If necessary, I will edit this post with further upgrades, and post the bug fixes or new features.


Summon Leviathan - Morphs a leviathan out of water, that quickly disappears if standing on land. With level, new abilities are unlocked. If cast from whatever, abilities have various advantages.

Aqua Rhapsody [buff spell] - If target should die while under the effect of the spell, it will be fully healed but will have its mana pool halved and will no longer be able to attack.

Screenshot:

Coral Wisdom [chain+buff spell] - Links a couple of units together. If one of the units loses mana, the loss is split to all the units.

Screenshot:

Sea Chant [AoE spell] - Sacrifices the caster by creating a triangle of arcane energy that drains mana from spellcasters and life from the rest. If casters are killed or channeling is stopped before spell finishes, the life&mana stolen is taken by the units around them.

Screenshot:

Enjoy!

~Daelin

[Daelin]

Another update.

- Added a new feature. Now water and land leviathan are different units so you can give different stats if you wish (in the test map, leviathan no longer regenerates mana and life on ground, and moves and attacks a bit slower).
- Added more information about how to implement spells into your map.
- Now spells follow JESP standard.

Edit: Reupdated.

- Added a comment which explains why two-leved abilities for leviathan are required.

Edit 2: And yet another update.

- New feature. Now statue units have spell immunity. I added it so that the spell may not be interrupted by stun or similar effects.
- Fixed a bug with transformation ability. Leviathan couldn't switch from land to water form. Now it works correctly!
- Added new implementability information.

~Daelin

[FireFreak]

once the leviathan has left the water, he does not regenerate mana at all, even if he goes swim again
also for a spellcasting unit, 200 mana are way not enough, not at all with such expensive spells!
the spells themselves are absolutly good, besides that i dont like a unit to show how much damage it deals but has no attack, that looks a bit wired.

[Daelin]

You probably downloaded the pack before I updated it. I have fixed the mana stuff. As for 200 mana... well, it's just a summoned unit, it shouldn't be overpowered. And nevertheless, you can change the amount from the object editor to whatever you want. That's just up to you however you like it.

And what did you mean by "i dont like a unit to show how much damage it deals but has no attack"? You're refering to the units channeling the last spell? Hmm... I could add separate units for statues though I prefere not to uselessly add other units when not that necessarily.

Ok, another small update.
- Statues are no longer magic immune but instead disappear when any of them is stopped channeling.

~Daelin

[Sharingan]

Hmm, one question:
Is the spell made for this contest supposed to be usuable for other maps?

[moyack]

Originally Posted by Sharingan

Hmm, one question:
Is the spell made for this contest supposed to be usuable for other maps?

Originally Posted by Daelin

- Now spells follow JESP standard.

in theory, all the spells in this contest have to work in other maps.

[Alevice]

Not really. It can just work in that specific map for the contest, however, if you want to submit it to the site, then thats another story (which tales of the multi-instanceable spell's adventures traveling through mutliple maps)

[Daelin]

I don't find a spell appropriate as long as long as it cannot be used in other maps. I mean, what's its use anymore if you can't import it somewhere else? Using specific units (from the map) into the script of the spell will make that spell completely useless in my opinion because it can hardly be implemented and reused. A spell is good when it is multiinstanceable and can be cast BY any and ON any valid unit.

Of course, being able to import it but lacking instructions from author is something else. That means accesibility (who can import the spell) and has nothing to do with the code, but with the user. That's how I think and that's how I find things fair!

JESP Standard? Well, I don't see why a spell following the standard should be better than another one not following it, excluding accesibility? I don't find the configuration functions crucial for a spell, but I find crucial using generic events (for global triggers).

Edit: New updates.

- Fixed a mispelled tooltip.
- New feature added at Sea Chant. Now heroes can be configured to lose less mana.
- Sea Chant can now be configured to regenerate or not life & mana of Magic Immune units.
- Aqua Rhapsody is not based on positive ability so buff has green name and unit icon upon current selected units does not appear red (affected by negative spell).
- Coral Wisdom no longer makes unit's icon red (as if unit is affected by negative spell) while under the effect of the spell.

~Daelin

[Sharingan]

Alevice, that's exactly what I was asking for.
Submitting a spell for people to use and to make spell for a contest are two things for me.

[Fulla]

well this contest(session 7) in particular is less "map compatible" than usual.

Generally most spells are useable.

[moyack]

I've made an upgrade of my spell in order to fix some bugs that I found.

Edit (09/08/2006): some fixes has been done to my spell.

• Tentacles are now spell immunes
• Fixed bug with Storm Bolt, now any stunning ability can block the spell.
• Multiinstanciability improved
• Splash special effect added when the tentacle is created

Download the updated map here: http://www.wc3campaigns.net/showthre...794#post828794

[Daelin]

Originally Posted by Fulla

well this contest(session 7) in particular is less "map compatible" than usual.

Why? I mean, if coded properly, any spell can be easily imported into another map. Of course, that depends on the code. These are lame excuses: "implementability is not required because this is just a contest" or "why would the spell need to be reimplemented? It was made only for the contest". No! Implementability has something to do with the way you coded the spell.

Of course it is easy to use such excuses if you are unable to generalize the spell, and I don't blame ya. I agree that it is more difficult to generalize a spell than it is to make it work only for the units of a map. But I am wondering if the problem here is the description of the spell or the coder who is making it. And I tend to say that the answer is the second variant. No matter how much you would deny it and say that "for you implementability is not necessary" it remains a fact: Implementability is crucial for any spell because the purpose of these spells is to use them into a map. If you make it work only in the test map, the spell is practically useless. I mean, what could anyone do with the test map? They would say "Wow, this spell is so cool". Just great! Now what? The spell remains to rot in a test map just because it is too difficult to import into another map.

And then I ask you, why do you make these spells if not so other people can use them? Just to showoff? Because then again, this is not the right attitude for a spellmaker. A spellmaker is someone who makes spells so that they are useful and bring something new to the gameplay of someone's map (maybe even your own map). If you make a spell for a CERTAIN map and you implement it directly into that map, that's something different. But if you just make the spell in a test map and it can't be reimplemented, well, in my opinion that spell can rot to dust because even if it is very good, the fact that it is unimplementable makes it crap.

Edit: Update.

- During the casting of Coral Wisdom if missile was sent towards an unit and that unit died before missile would reach it, the code would enter into an infinite loop and spell would not work. Bug is now fixed and spell works correctly even in such cases.
- Added a new feature for Sea Chant. Now statue units can have a different type than the one of the caster. I did not add different unit in test map, but may be very easily modified if needed.

~Daelin

[rulerofiron99]

the way i see it, the point of these spell making sessions is just for the spell ideas and a bit of fun. we aren't making spells here for the sake of other maps. we can if we want to, but that isnt the real point of spell making sessions.

[Alevice]

Originally Posted by Daelin

Why? I mean, if coded properly, any spell can be easily imported into another map. Of course, that depends on the code. These are lame excuses: "implementability is not required because this is just a contest" or "why would the spell need to be reimplemented? It was made only for the contest". No! Implementability has something to do with the way you coded the spell.

They way the spell was coded is totally irrelevant. You are encouraged to have it easy to implement somewhere else, but not obligated.

This is basically a creativity contest in the form of a magic spell within a videogame, not on the expertise in some specific medium. While the later will certainly give you bonus points, its absence shouldn't prevent being at least judged.

Originally Posted by Daelin

Of course it is easy to use such excuses if you are unable to generalize the spell, and I don't blame ya. I agree that it is more difficult to generalize a spell than it is to make it work only for the units of a map. But I am wondering if the problem here is the description of the spell or the coder who is making it. And I tend to say that the answer is the second variant.

Is anyone stating the opposite? Most people don't do it because they can't. That is completely irrelevant here. Once again, this is not the submission board, regardless whoemever wins the contest, only the spells that are adept to the submissions rules will be able to be there.

Originally Posted by Daelin

No matter how much you would deny it and say that "for you implementability is not necessary" it remains a fact: Implementability is crucial for any spell because the purpose of these spells is to use them into a map. If you make it work only in the test map, the spell is practically useless. I mean, what could anyone do with the test map? They would say "Wow, this spell is so cool". Just great! Now what? The spell remains to rot in a test map just because it is too difficult to import into another map.

Let the spellmaker take that decision. It is their choice wether or not their spell will survive a silly contest.

Originally Posted by Daelin

And then I ask you, why do you make these spells if not so other people can use them? Just to showoff? Because then again, this is not the right attitude for a spellmaker.

People enter just for fun. At least I do. Heck, I am not a spellmaker, I am a mapmaker that could make some effective ideas for my own later use. While I attempt that my spells are completely multiinstanceable (and suck at it) and works across maps, it doesn't mean I should.

Don't impose your mentality over others when it comes to how they want to do things.

Originally Posted by Daelin

A spellmaker is someone who makes spells so that they are useful and bring something new to the gameplay of someone's map (maybe even your own map). If you make a spell for a CERTAIN map and you implement it directly into that map, that's something different. But if you just make the spell in a test map and it can't be reimplemented, well, in my opinion that spell can rot to dust because even if it is very good, the fact that it is unimplementable makes it crap.

Who are you to say what makes a spell crap anyway? You may be one of the spellmakers around, but your word is not the law in any case.

EDIT: In short, I just repeated what rulerofiron99 already said :P